Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Unless a member currently owns a 1961 up year model truck they can positively prove as having a VIN plate on the kick panel and not on the door frame, I believe it to be correct to say all 1960 year model trucks have the VIN stamped on the wide aluminum kick panel tag and all 1961 up trucks have a separate VIN in the door frame or as you showed in your pics - on the forward door pillar. So an "N" series truck with a forward mounted VIN plate and higher production # is likely a 61 (regardless of what the title says) and a "N" series truck with lower production number and kick panel mounted VIN would be indicative of a 1960 year model. Anyone experienced enough with 60-61 GMCs willing to concur?

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

One thing I have found out about these trucks over the years. Just as soon as you are certain that things were made a specific way a specific year... you will find at least one exception. Original exception...

This appears especially true when the vehicles share a year code. Take a look at the VINs reported by members in the past, is there a rhyme or reason to the numbering?

http://6066gmcguy.com/GMC-vin-list-60.html
http://6066gmcguy.com/GMC-vin-list-61.html

There doesn't even seem to be a correlation between the engine number and the year, let alone between the serial number and the year.

And this is just for 1960-61.
With some similarity compare 64-66 which used both a single year code and separate year codes, depending on plant(?)

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

So in 1958 GMC decided to make all 58 and 59 year model trucks a single "S" series; all 58's have a shorter production number and all 59's have a longer one because 59 VIN's started in the middle of the run. Same with 60-61 N series trucks - one of the 1960's was #1 off the line and one of the 1961's was 100,000 + or wherever they ended the run. So yes - there is a definite correlation between 60-61's production # wise.

You guys have my curiosity up now and I'm going to have to ride 18 miles out to my farm and see if that alledged "1960" GMC spare parts truck has a VIN tag on the kick panel or door jamb....I'll take pics when I get there

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

The manual I have, and was quoted by David, says Kick Panel or pillar. It is a X-6023 printed in 1961 I believe. You could deduce if they said that, they were going to put them either/or. It says it replaces a X-6003. Wonder what it says? If X-6003 is the first manual for 1960, and it says either/or, and I have an original 1960 with holes in the pillar, it may mean they were giving themselves options for different factories/tag suppliers or cabs were punched with those holes for 1960 Chevy. It seems that on the WIKIweb, all Chevy's had pillar. Depends on what X-6003 say somewhat. Interesting, at any rate. I think 55-59 GMC was a wide tag and the hinge pillar was wide so they mounted them there. I think I've learned what David said, there always seems to be an original exception. Quality control, specific procedures were a little lax back then. Maybe X-6003 says kick panel only. It has a print date of 1959.
Don't know if poster serial is high or not, our data says 95,000 V6's in 1960. Also Jmclendon shows chart with 15 as 1/2T is that not 3/4T? His "B" rating is 6000-10,000. Decoder hiccup?

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Good luck finding a X-6003. I have been looking and haven't found one yet. I do have a X-6004B which is Preliminary Instructions Models 5500-9000. Inside it is copyrighted 1960 (6M 11-60)

My X-6023 is Copyright 1960. (12M X-6023 6-60) and Reprints (5M 5-61) (1M 11-63) (5C 6-65) (1m 3-72) so I would assume mine is from the 3-72 Reprint. Even though it's condition suggests it has been abused for much longer.

For reference my X-6034 Models 5500-9000 replaces X-6004A, X-6004B, and X-6031 and is copyright 1961 (85C X-6034 2-61) and reprint (5M 9-61) and is almost pristine.

Just for confusions sake, I have the X-5918 Diesel Engine Maintenance Manual Model 6V-71. It should be for the 1959 models with that manual number, but the copyright date is 1960 (12M-Mar. 1960) which suggests I have an original printing from March 1960 for the 1959 6V-71. Manual came out after the beginning of the '59 model year (and probably the end of that model year as well)

NOW, the X-6034 manual states, regarding the Chassis Serial Number, "The chassis serial number is stamped on an identification plate, shown above. Plate is mounted on the cab left door hinge pillar or on inside of left door."

The plate pictured is identical to the plate in the picture of my 1961 1500.

Maybe the holes weren't for the Chevy models, but for the bigger truck models? The W5500 model for 1960 looks like the same cab but with much larger fender flares. Kind of like the 1963 4000 I have.

To further muddy the waters, the X-6223 manual I have indicates the plate for the cowl left side panel (pictured) is for the "L" & "S" models and the pillar plate (also pictured) is for all except the "L" & "S" models according to the captions under the pictures. The volume I have is copyright 1962 (12M X-6223 2-62). It covers, and I quote, "MODELS 1000 THRU 5000 "J" SERIES AND "N" SERIES BUILT AFTER AUGUST 14, 1961"
So it appears we could have "N" series trucks as 1962 trucks as well.

The pictures show the "L" & "S" model as the large plate, the other as the same plate as in the picture of my 1961 1500.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

My X-6023 says "Printed in U.S.A. 12M X-6023 6-60 Reprint 5M 5-61.

Regarding X-6003: I don't know how many reprints there are but I have seen one that says: ©1959 General Motors Corporation, GMC Truck and Coach Division, 10M X-6003 9-59. Would be interesting to read the Serial plate info.
As our own data says (Jolly), it is almost impossible to know a 1960 from a 1961 without documentation. The "N" series is the most difficult. A title would not even be proof positive but close enough for Government work.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Well, I will say I'm glad this thread has opened up some quality discussions around this.

I'm a sponge over here, soaking up all of this good information and discussion.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

I just grabbed one of these on ebay. Not sure if original or reprint.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/182346385693...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Great price.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

The X-6003 manual I referenced says the same thing as X-6023.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

So to speak to the purpose of the two VIN tag holes in a 1000 series GMC trucks' door frame; they are stamped out as part of the manufacturing process for that piece of sheetmetal which was indeed used on constructing Chevrolet cabs, and larger series GMC's where a different type of VIN plate may have been used. I checked my 1960 parts truck and it came with the kick panel tag and I also called a friend who is a local expert on early "knee knocker" trucks and he's never seen a 1960 GMC with a door post VIN plate. So, unless someone can provide proof of a US made (Mexican or Canadian assembly plant produced trucks very well might have had a door pillar mounted tag) 1960 1000 series pickup coming with a door pillar mounted tag I think its safe to say that all 1960 1000 series trucks have the kick panel mounted VIN plate like the 55-59 trucks had. 1961 is when I believe GMC went to the slimmer tag mounted on the door jamb.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

It figures. I quit looking for a while and one turns up. Not only that, but for a good price (I see another one listed for $49, not "affordable") Congrats.
You will probably want the X-6023 as well though.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

I agree but I gave up, not worth it. The "proof" is hard to come by because there are 61's titled as 60's and, as I said, almost impossible to tell. Same motor, same series and so on. Especially with no title. The theory of different methods at different factories is weak in my opinion. You will find different methods at SAME factory, Then what do you say? Are you going to say that at the same factory they made two styles of tags in 1960 and workers had two different build instructions for 1960? More than likely a pillar tag 60 is a late 1960 build which was build like a 61. Is a 61, but titled/registered in 1960. As far as attitude, because I knew 60 had kick panel I thought poster was trying to pull a fast one on DMV. Thinking that he should have been able to get a title if truck had already been registered as he posted. So there would be a record of this truck and it's VIN in Texas. No mention of why no title or bill of sale. That was fishy to me. I guess he was not scamming, just not understanding his is not a 60. I guess Snazzypig and GMCNUT are wrong also.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

I wonder when was the last year those VIN plate holes were punched?

Could it be that the first location ended up being a bad spot and the plates would vibrate over time and fall off or the rivets were weak?
I see they got moved to the top part of the cab later on. Rivets on mine look cheap compared to the rosette style.

My 61 Suburban only has the kick panel plate. The two holes in the front pillar look clean and unused, but the truck did have a cheap repaint in it's past.
I'm the 3rd owner and the 2nd owner gave me original owner's old receipts and registration from 1975 showing it as 1961 model year. I have repair receipts going back as far as 1970 with the original owners name, listing it as a 1961.

First thing I tried to find was build sheet but no dice. I even looked on top of the gas tank. The original owner is still alive (89y.o., I think ) and I tried to call him but nobody picked up.

Either way 60 or 61 is all good with me :woo:

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Funky: Actual Mileage, wow, that's nice. Date first sold 00/00/61 is weird? I wonder if yours is a left over 60? We can now call this post a Trivia Post. Your rivets are correct for 60. Other 61 trucks show a different style. Rivets were under evolution as were plates.

Anyway the holes were punched in that upper A pillar section at the Pontiac MI GM truck assembly plant which built GMC AND Chevy assemblies. Most of the cab parts were interchangeable, would have holes for Chevy and GMC plate locations and would all be designed to accommodate Chevy or GMC dash sections. The Pontiac East Plant was on a massive GM campus which included the Metal Stamping Plant (Pontiac Metal Center). The Pontiac East was shut down and some plants were demolished on the property in 2009. "The shutdown of the last assembly plant in what was once a central production hub of GM is part of the forced bankruptcy and restructuring of the US automaker by the Obama administration". GM filled bankruptcy in 2009, was restructured (bailed out) and in 2015 was said to be spending huge money to renew the Pontiac metal stamping plant where many of our trucks were built. It has taken all this time to recover from the past "economy". We, the people, spent $50 BILLION to bailout GM and recovered all but $10.3B. We bailed out Chrysler too. Ford did not ask for our money.


RE: 60-61 ID.
Pictures of a particular truck in question including dash colors and the trim could possibly give some clues.
Windshield/glass code/dates, and other small indicators could maybe, possibly distinguish a 60 from 61. Wheels would, hub caps would, heater maybe.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Hub caps would ?

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Thinking of Chevy.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

So here is a picture of a truck from a member that is said to be 1961 and it's caption. This is what I said about same factory, different location does not make since. This could be a 1960 as the owner sort of indicates.
Same factory as poster. Kick panel location....and he has the unused pillar holes. This is a %100 nice original truck. Notice the rivet style also.

Caption:
"VIN 1001PN19787A breaks down as 10 = 1000 series, 01 = 115"; wheelbase, P = Pontiac, Michigan assembly plant, N was used for the 1960 & 1961 model years depending on when the truck was sold & titled new."

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

One more bit: I only have Chevy info, sorry. But it does give insight to GM thinking on plates and has to be included to beat the horse dead. All 1/2T info.

Source: GM Heritage Center/Vehicle Information Kits

1960 no mention
1961 RPO 399 "Special Serial Number Plate"
1962 STD equipment "GVW Plate 5000 Lbs"
1963 STD equipment "GVW Plate 5000 Lbs"
1964 Index lists Regular Production Equipment p 6, no p 6.
1964 RPO Z55 "Special Serial Number Plate"
1965 STD equipment "GVW Plate 5000 Lbs" and RPO (no number) "Serial Number Plate (State of Pennsylvania)"
1966 STD equipment "GVW Plate 5000 Lbs" and RPO Z55K "Serial Number Plate (State of Pennsylvania)"
:deadhorse:

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Hey there Angry Pirate!. and welcome to the site.

I (still) have a '63 GMC Suburban that I bought from my Dad in Feb 1973, and the VIN plate, or serial number, is in the same place as the pic you posted from Jolly's legacy page. The page does state that this ID plate should be in the location that is shown- outside of the door weatherstrip seal and about halfway up from the dogleg. Your 60 truck has the plate in the same location as my 63, and Jolly's info that he provided matches up for 60-63 as the right location. Also checked my K-1000 Suburban, and this VIN plate is in the same location. I've attached a picture showing this.

I do remember reading some time ago that Chevy trucks had the truck ID stamped on the driver side frame rail as you stated, but GMC trucks had no such stamping on the frame. This agrees with the several 62-66 GMC trucks I have owned over the last 40-plus years.

Good luck with your truck!

Jim

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

This discussion is not about 62 and up plate location/style. There is no problem with 62 and up. 60 is different. Some 60's are 61. I believe that's all there is to it. Our 6066Club pages have already been modified to reflect no stamping on frame. Further modifications are being reviewed.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Jim , 1960 and some 1961s had a kick panel vin tag or as some say , serial # . 1961s generally have an A pillar VIN tag but it is a totally different style used from 1961-1962 and possibly on some 1960 GMCs. I have three 1962s , all have the A pillar VIN like my one 1961 does , it is a mainly a black colored tag and larger than the one you posted which started on 1963 GMCs. From what I have and what I've seen NONE of the A pillar 1961 1962 VIN tag trucks have kick panel GVW tags , they have the holes there but were not given a tag . 1963 GMC has the normal GVW tag on the kick panel and in 1963 they changed the VIN tag to a spot welded stainless tag like Chevys , some may have been riveted but my 63 is spot welded on from the factory. AngryPilot "thought" his GVW kick panel tag was missing , when in actuality his 1960 was left blank from the factory. Thats what this discussion was primarily about. I've asked him now to check the dates on his engine , he might get a better sense of when his truck was built by those dates.

Heres what a 1960 GMC tags look like on the kick panel with the A pillar blank.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...%20GMC/005.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...0GMC/001_1.jpg

And this is what the 1961-1962 VIN tag looks like.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...%20GMC/012.jpg

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Now we are getting somewhere. Good solid info gmccollector! I have come to the conclusion (I believe it's what gmccollector said) that 60 has all-in-one, GVW and serial on one plate at kick panel. 61's, if they are not left over/buy back 60's, have all-in-one, GVW and serial on A pillar. Some so called 60's were built in late 60 as 61's with 61 plates. The 61 style plate may have continued until a little later when two tags were used, a serial number tag on pillar and a GVW tag on kick panel. It seems like the 60 to 61 transition has a rivet change also, away from the 55-60 style. Some plates were indeed welded but either rusted or fell off sometimes. I have noticed the A pillar serial number tags sometimes carry the DD (Delivery Date) embossed. This area very seldom got completed with date. Thanks again for good clarification by gmccollector.
The "N" series does not allow us to identify 1960 dealer left overs and 1960 October, Nov, Dec built 61's, except maybe the build quantity number.....and the plates! :mys_solved1:

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Thanks GMCCOLLECTOR! I'm going to check my numbers as well.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Thank you Ken ;), one thing while looking at these though , from 1961-1962 , there are no GVW plates at all . If the VIN tag is on the A pillar , theres NO tag at all on the kick panel , that's what Im seeing anyway. I'm curious if that's consistent on all of them , I looked at about 8 original trucks

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Yes I agree, that is what I tried to say above but not that well. All-in-one on the A pillar (all in one meaning GVW info and Serial No. and Engine info all on one plate that is on the A pillar for 61 and I guess 62. There is no other plate. It was not necessary. If we say "no GVW plates at all" it is sort of misleading.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

We are on the same page now , just meant no GVW plate on the kick panel

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

It's a 1960...or a leftover I guess

Well here are the numbers on my intake manifold and my exhaust manifolds.

Now I'd like to see some numbers from a 1961 as per this thread with just the plate on the A pillar.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

Great info. A lot to be learned here.

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

:welldone: I guess that Im NOT the only one that AZKEN acts like this to. Seems to be a dark conspiracy behind his troll posts. lol

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

This excerpt from another member goes with my last post.

Another well known site validating mine is in the correct place. Let's see this manual you keep telling us about. Snap a picture for a brother, would ya?

Thanks again Ken for your rude and condescending response.

Always a pleasure. Please stop responding to any of my posts. :goodjob:

Re: 1960 Pick up VIN location
 

This is a 15 month old post. I have learned and moved forward to do a study with the help of many members. Then I compiled a new VIN page and/serial number location, cypher, decoder, by years with pictures. Using info from all the owners here. Jeannie edited and posted the revised info. We now have the best known accurate information. It is always subject to input.

I am not sure what bringing this up 15 months later is all about. Refer to our pages if you have questions on Serial no's, plates, etc.

I will continue to respond to any post I chose and will not be intimidated by a JR. snowflake with sensitive feelings.
The link below is another attack from another post today. This one shows that he does not know that it's not his English I refer to, but his actual words to describe his situation. He got caught and is angry about it obviously. I gave the direct, honest and very helpful answers as to value. I do think that plain English is hard for him to understand or appreciate. Troll and Geritol are his limits.
https://6066gmcclub.com/showthread.p...8924#post68924