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-   -   1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy) (https://6066gmcclub.com/showthread.php?t=47321)

FetchMeAPepsi September 8th, 2018 05:59 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
So where were we? Oh right. I replaced that whole under-cab fuel filter with a new one and a new O ring. Should be good, right?
Nope.

Try as I might I still could not get gas to come to the carb. Or even to the filter! I primed and primed and primed and primed that carb but got nothing.

I thought, Hmm, maybe my carb filter is full or bad? Don't know how it could be, it wasn't before...but OK. So I took it off and ran straight pipe to the carb from the fuel pump.




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Still nuttin! I primed that entire hose then, to see if the pump would shoot it back out. Maybe the pump was bad? But no, it shot all over the place. Pump was fine.

I scratched my head, drank a pepsi, and thought a bit more. Wonder what would happen if I primed the whole line all the way to the under cab filter - wait, no. How about ALL THE WAY TO THE TANK???
:ahhhh:



So I took a gray funnel and stuck some fuel tubing in it, about 2 1/2 feet worth.




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Then I stuck my fuel filter on the end to have it be the right size to fit into the fuel line that ties to the bottom of the fuel pump.




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Then I unplugged the fuel pump, held the funnel in one hand way up high (way higher than the gas tank inside), and started slowly filling the line up.
(no more pics, had to use 2 hands)


And when I was sure it was full and washing back into the tank, I hooked it all back up again, spilling gasoline all over myself and the ground, and tried to start her again.


And surprise, surprise, Cecilia came alive again! Woohoo! :rowdybeer:


She smoked, and puffed like a railroad bull for about 20 minutes too. I don't know what crawled up her butt while she was parked but it was not happy about her running again, haha! Eventually she quit all the smoking though, and I thought "Heck, I might as well take the old girl for a spin". :thumbsup:


I stepped inside, shut the door, and put my foot on the clutch - and the dang thing went straight to the floor. It didn't even try to come up! I pulled it up by hand and ran around to check the master cyl. Of course it was dry.

So I filled it up, pumped the clutch by hand, and it still didn't stay up. Not sure what happened here, but as of right now I'm clutchless. I'll try to figure that out and get it fixed before winter. Talk about your let-downs!

FetchMeAPepsi October 29th, 2018 01:52 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
After sitting for a couple of days with the reservoir full I got it working again by pumping the clutch. I guess it just needed to drain down some, but there's still a leak to fix....


Also, Cecilia quit working again. As in, she wouldn't start. I pulled off the gas line and guess what? No gas. I guess all that time with the tank empty while I was changing it broke the fuel pump? I don't know, but either way I knew it wasn't pumping.

So, back to the auto parts store. I bought a new one for $80 bucks with a LIFETIME WARRANTY....




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And started putting it in, when the Powder Puff decided to come out and give me a hand! Surprise, surprise!




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We got it in pretty straightaway. I added a new clear fuel filter too so i can see what's going on in there. Part number:




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After that Cecilia fired right up again. She's alive!



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The Little Blonde pretend-drove her around a little before I got in to take them for a spin (she's in the foreground, just hair lol). I was surprised when I let out on the clutch and Cecilia didn't move. She revved fine, but didn't move an inch. that's when I noticed the 4wd lever sticking up abnormally. I guess The Little Blonde had shifted it up into neutral and I was just sitting there like an idiot, wondering what else was going to go wrong today!

Well once that was back in gear we took off down the road. Cecilia wasn't running right, pretty rough any time I gave her gas actually. And the transmission still won't go into 2nd gear. But we were able to scoot her around the block and wave at some strangers. Good times!

I think I'll pull her around to the garage next week and fiddle with that slave cylinder, transmission and maybe the timing a bit. Learning as we go!

FetchMeAPepsi April 5th, 2019 09:21 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
My last time to fiddle with Cecilia was October 2018. That's too long! I got out there today and you know, it's been rainy and yucky so it's wet everywhere. there's no reason to work on my other projects when it's nasty. Let's tinker with Cecilia! I miss driving her.

I also hate her wheels and tires. They're easier to turn, but they look so bad. I really need to do something about that.

Anyway, today was all just a tinker. I jumped in thinking i'd add just the right resistor to her fuel wire and poof! She'd be good again. Wrong!

I removed the sending unit.



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With the sending unit removed and the float all the way down (empty) I get this on the gauge.




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So I looked at moving this tab that keeps it from going down further.



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Like so..





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And while it did move lower for me, it still didn't make a difference on the gauge. It was like it was stuck at that 1/4 tank.

James April 6th, 2019 02:29 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
I recommend the fuel probe be installed in the gas tank before any troubleshooting can take place for safety reasons.

There could be issue with the power or ground side of the fuel probe. If you have a voltmeter you can test it for a faulty power or ground. But first before doing that let try this quick and easy test. Disconnect the wire from the stud. Connect a jumper to a good ground in the cab. The other end of the jumper to the wire (that goes on the fuel probe stud). Turn the key on. This should make the gauge reads empty.

The following tests must be done with the key on just like you need to read the gas gauge and all wiring connected. When checking be sure to check both side of a connector (i.e. The wire on the fuel probe stud, you would check the terminal then check the stud for power. It should be the same but it could have a thin film of oxidation creating a bad connection.) Also look at the wire where it attached to the terminal, if there any broken strands or a green coloration (corrosion) replace the terminal, this is added resistance.

After the quick test, if it doesn't read empty there is resistance/corrosion between the gauge and the sending unit. Using a voltmeter measure the voltage (check your wiring diagram first) on the back of the gauge. This voltage should be the same all the way to the fuel probe stud.

After the quick test, if it does reads empty use a voltmeter and see if there a voltage drop between the fuel probe base and a good ground, voltmeter should read 0 volts . If you have any voltage move the probe toward the ground point until you read 0 volts.

If you have a change in voltage drop the you have a bad connection (resistance/corrosion). Disassemble, clean, reassemble, and retest.

If you need addition help let me know.

jagarra April 6th, 2019 04:51 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
As you moved the float up and down, did the gauge follow it? I guess the next thing to determine is when the float is in the lowest position is the resistance the highest or lowest at the point. If it is lowest or zero then the gauge and sender may be mismatched.

If you have a meter what is the range as the float is moved over it's travel?

FetchMeAPepsi April 6th, 2019 07:02 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by James (Post 70770)
I recommend the fuel probe be installed in the gas tank before any troubleshooting can take place for safety reasons.

There could be issue with the power or ground side of the fuel probe. If you have a voltmeter you can test it for a faulty power or ground. But first before doing that let try this quick and easy test. Disconnect the wire from the stud. Connect a jumper to a good ground in the cab. The other end of the jumper to the wire (that goes on the fuel probe stud). Turn the key on. This should make the gauge reads empty.

The following tests must be done with the key on just like you need to read the gas gauge and all wiring connected. When checking be sure to check both side of a connector (i.e. The wire on the fuel probe stud, you would check the terminal then check the stud for power. It should be the same but it could have a thin film of oxidation creating a bad connection.) Also look at the wire where it attached to the terminal, if there any broken strands or a green coloration (corrosion) replace the terminal, this is added resistance.

After the quick test, if it doesn't read empty there is resistance/corrosion between the gauge and the sending unit. Using a voltmeter measure the voltage (check your wiring diagram first) on the back of the gauge. This voltage should be the same all the way to the fuel probe stud.

After the quick test, if it does reads empty use a voltmeter and see if there a voltage drop between the fuel probe base and a good ground, voltmeter should read 0 volts . If you have any voltage move the probe toward the ground point until you read 0 volts.

If you have a change in voltage drop the you have a bad connection (resistance/corrosion). Disassemble, clean, reassemble, and retest.

If you need addition help let me know.

Thanks James! I'll give this a try tomorrow. The tank is empty so I'm safe ;)


Quote:

Originally Posted by jagarra (Post 70771)
As you moved the float up and down, did the gauge follow it? I guess the next thing to determine is when the float is in the lowest position is the resistance the highest or lowest at the point. If it is lowest or zero then the gauge and sender may be mismatched.

If you have a meter what is the range as the float is moved over it's travel?


Yes, it did move as I moved the float. It's just that last 1/4 of a tank that won't disappear. The gauge stops but the float keeps going down.

High resistance is full, no resistance is empty. I didn't meter it since it seemed a ground in the dash on the gauge (?) may be the problem.

FetchMeAPepsi April 11th, 2019 02:17 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
I narrowed my gas issue down to the gauge. It wasn't connecting well under these posts.



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The grounding post went to this pin, that connects to the brown wire and runs to the gas tank behind the seat.




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Sadly, to test the connection i ran a direct line from the battery's negative post to the post on the gauge. it worked great, but when I pulled it off I accidentally hit the OTHER post with the grounding wire. That blew the entire thing!




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See the copper burned up by that pin? That's the pin that goes to the positive terminal (closest to the speedometer) on the fuel gauge. It also runs the Low Oil and Gen lights. The copper is very thin back there. It cooked straight through.

FetchMeAPepsi April 11th, 2019 02:31 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
So I cleaned up the terminals with a dremmel and a tiny wire wheel attachment. It worked great! i checked the resistance with a multimeter too and it was zero. Then I soldered the broken copper back together.




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With that part registering good again I thought, may as well clean all the connections up and get some dash lights again! So I wire wheeled (very lightly) all the electrical connections for every light. Now my Gen light works, my Low oil light, my Hi Beam, and Turn Signal, and even my night time lights work most of the time! Woohoo!
I still have a short on the light pull-out switch somewhere that keeps the night time lights from being 100% fixed. If I wiggle it it works.

Anyway, now that the gauge was good, i still was having problems with the gas registering right. Now instead of showing it 1/4 or 1/8th of a tank empty, it was FULL ALL OF THE TIME.

That means the resistance was 100% from the gauge to the ground wire, through the float! More mystery!


I put the multimeter on the sending unit this time and it showed zero connection. That's not right! I pulled the sending unit. I ran it through it's range and still got nothing until the very end of the range, at the FULL setting. It wasn't much though, huge resistance, as it should be at full.



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I traced it back checking for resistance and found that the break in connection was in the dang float resistance meter thingy (pictured above). I popped that open (it was only 20 something bucks) and looked inside. It worked at the top, like we already knew, but just under that the little tiny wire inside was broken! aha!

I think this must have happened when I bent the tab and moved it past it's intended area. I'll take blame for this one. To fix it, (no pics) I just bent the broken wire back under the neighboring wires so that it stuck with its own pressure. Now that I think about it, that's probably not a good idea. A broken connection in a gas tank?
I wonder if it'll spark if things get bumpy?

Looks like I'll be ordering a new one. I just scared myself.

Anyway, this is what the gauge looks like right now.



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Not too bad, huh? Oh, and look at this cool sticker I found in my speedometer area!




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It looks like that place is an inspection company now. I wonder what happened to it?

Well, that's it for today. tomorrow I'm going to try to tune the engine a bit and get her moving again. then I need to fix that 2nd gear issue that's driving me crazy.

FetchMeAPepsi April 11th, 2019 11:04 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
I meant to get her running again today and adjust all the little bits that make the motor run better, but I forgot that I ran the gas out of her to prep for the gas tank work. I spent over an hour priming and trying to start her again. Ended up having to prime all the fuel line back to the tank, and then prime everything in front of the fuel pump. Fun times.

Several times i walked past the bed and thought "I really need to make a maiden voyage to the dump". I have been throwing stuff in the bed for a while now. So once I was finished getting her running again I got the tailgate from the fence where it has sat propped up for the last (probably) 6 years. It was filthy.

I put it on the top hangers and checked the fit. I guess the ground didn't rust it down to nothing, thank goodness. It fit like a glove. Then it was time for the hardware.

I remembered seeing one of the latch bolts on a shelf with the spare tire holder. The bolt was still inside it, thank goodness.

But there was only one of them in there. And no chains. What the heck?

I poked around a bit and and then a tiny spark of remembrance sparked up - I liked to put stuff in plastic buckets when i was working on tearing her apart. And in the bottom of my parts cabinet I found this crushed, messy mess.



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But guess what?



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And?


Hallelujah!


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FetchMeAPepsi April 11th, 2019 11:12 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
I went ahead and hung the chain latches so the tailgate wouldn't fall on me.



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Look at that messy dirt still in there! That side channel is FULL!



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I dug it all out with a flathead screwdriver and blew it out with compressed air. (Yes, I did get that bit off the outside before I knocked off for the day!)



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Then I put the little round catch in the tailgate bottom like so.




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Surprisingly the bolt lined right up with just a little jiggering.





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Then I grabbed the ends of the chains. Thank goodness they're square bolts so I can figure out where they go without too much guessing.




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FetchMeAPepsi April 11th, 2019 11:15 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
They didn't even give me trouble going throuth the farm bumper and into the bed rail.




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It took a 5/8" wrench on the bottom bolts, but this one was just 1/2".



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But now she's back to good. You know, she doesn't look like much, but I sure do love piddling with her.




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olsonrambler May 4th, 2019 07:40 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Thank you for the tutorial--came in handy since I'm working on my Muncie 318.

FetchMeAPepsi October 9th, 2019 03:44 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by olsonrambler (Post 70944)
Thank you for the tutorial--came in handy since I'm working on my Muncie 318.

Thanks OR, i'm glad it helped! Hey, if you get it back together and it won't stay in second, let me know if you fix that problem :)

Today i got to love on my baby a little bit. I did NOT take any pictures though :banghead:

because we've already established that I'm an idiot.

So here's what went down. That dorman slave cylinder I bought? It's on now. Leaked brake fluid all down my arm and into some cracks that I thought wouldn't accept a leak, but they did. However, now that it's on and bled out, my clutch doesn't leak anymore! Here's how I did it, in words only (again, sorry!)


Get new dorman slave cylinder.
Get a 9/16 socket and wrench.
Get crescent wrench for juice tube from clutch line.
Set emergency brake. Watch truck roll as brake is set.
Mutter some stuff your mama shouldn't hear you say.
Get a big butt brick and set it under one wheel. Smile at your ingenuity.

Remind yourself to fix that e-brake tension later.

Crawl under truck, forgetting to remove your hat. Bang head on fender.
Force head under through the tire well with anger, knocking off hat into brake fluid puddle.
Use hat to sop up brake puddle since it's there anyway. May as well!

Poke at rubber sleeve on slave cylinder. move quickly to prevent gush of fluid from landing in eye. Remember to wash hair extra tonight.

Finally, put 9/16 socket on bottom bolt on slave cylinder and loosen. Do the same for top bolt.
Once loose, take out and let cylinder hang.
Pull out the rod that goes to the throw out bearing arm and lay on ground.
Use crescent wrench and try to brake loose juice line from clutch. Realize you should have done this before removing the bolts.
Keep trying it because you're stubborn. Get more brake fluid in face and down both arms. It's a bath now.

Finally brake it loose without bending metal juice line. Horray!

Remove slave cylinder and put on ground. Throw from under truck. Cat hisses.

Remember that you should put plumbers tape on juice connection to prevent leaks and run out from under truck to get it.

Get sidetracked on a drink, talking to a neighbor.

Get back to work with only 1 hour to spare before the kids get home. Yikes!
Reattach slave cylinder but forget to put push rod back in.
Remove slave cylinder.
Reattach push rod by pushing into slave cylinder.
Put push rod through clutch bracket thing again.
Put two bolts back in slave cylinder, which is in the wrong location now, and looks backwards.
It is backwards.
Turn it back around.
Decide to connect the juice line first this time.
It won't go in. wonder if you bought the wrong replacement part.
Finally get it lined up and tightened up. Forgot plumber's tape.

Remove line and add plumber's tape. Thankfully it's in the right direction.
Line up juice line again and after just 13 tries it goes back in. Thank goodness.

Remember you have to bleed it and loosen bleed bolt.

Poke rod through clutch bracket again.
Put two bolts back in slave cylinder and get them lined up after only 5-900 tries.
Wife comes out now and remarks on how tan I look with all the black on my face from the undercarriage dirt. Say something witty. I didn't. But pretend I did.

Tighten bolts up good, but not so good that they strip out.
Mash clutch push rod in all the way because it comes pressed out, not in.
Now adjust your push rod nut if necessary.
Get kid to mash clutch, sending brake fluid all over your already soaked face and arms until bled thoroughly.

Enjoy your new puddle-less clutch!

FetchMeAPepsi October 9th, 2019 03:48 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Now I really need to fix that 2nd gear problem. I need to drive her tomorrow so we might have to take the slow lane, I guess.

It's really weird, I can get it to go in second, but it's like it doesn't go far enough into gear, then when I push the gas and it gets a load on (acceleration), it pops out of gear and I'm left revving my engine.

I'll figure it out eventually, but if anyone has any tips i'd be glad to hear 'em!

FetchMeAPepsi October 9th, 2019 07:37 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Well i tell you hwat, fellas.




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Cecilia tried to kill me today. I got her up, engine was great, and off we went to pick up some insulation from Lowes.
On the way back heading up the hill to my place she decided she didn't want to go in gear - any gear. At all. She'd touch on second gear and grind slightly, but not move at all of course, because second gear hasn't worked in a while.
But now she won't even grind in reverse, 1st, or third. I'm worried things are buggared up in there.

So here I was on a major four lane road and cars whizzing by giving me evil looks (why???) and so I stop, yank on the e-brake, and POP! My cable breaks. HAHA!

Now I'm stuck in the truck with my foot on the brake, no gears to move forward, and no way to stop the truck from rolling so i can get under there and fiddle with it.

Thankfully a construction worker happened by with a tow strap and he hauled me all the way to next-to my yard. I'm about 100 feet from parked. I thank God above for good people.

My plan now is to see if I can get it to go in first somehow manually, then get her parked in the drive so I can pull the transmission again (fun times!) and see what's buggared up.

Stay tuned!

FetchMeAPepsi October 10th, 2019 02:27 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Here's a funny little way to get your truck turned around if you can't move it under its own power. We were sideways to the gate to put Cecilia up, so we pushed her up past the gate to where the front wheels were past the gate, but the back were even with the gate.

Then I jacked up the back under the pumpkin, put a 4x4 piece of wood about 3" tall under the bumper, then let it down slowly while pushing the back toward the gate.

After 20 minutes and about 10 up/down pushes, we got the back end pointed into the gate and were able to push her back home. Hard work, dangerous because she could fall. But it was successful and now she won't be towed!

Here's a pic of the powder puff putting the 4x4 under the back while I maneuver the jack. Actually, all you can see of her is a gray boot under the pumpkin. The board is already set and leaning a bit in the way we want to move. She's getting big guys. You wouldn't believe it if I showed you.




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FetchMeAPepsi June 20th, 2020 08:16 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Ok guys, I finally had time to dig into poor ol' Cecilia yesterday. I pulled the tranny just like before, except I clamped a vise grip on the 4wd shifter first, then took out the u joint bolts, the inspection cover for the clutch, and the four bolts on the front of the tranny.

When I got it open, 1st/reverse gear was stuck on neutral. Second gear was stuck on neutral. Neither would move.

Why?

Somehow two or three of those small needle bearings that go on the center of the main shaft fell off and got chewed up under the 2nd/3rd gear that slides back and forth. See the paste that the gears turned that bearing into...



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Thankfully these are tough transmissions and it pretty much just ate one bearing for dinner and froze up with the other two in the gears that the second/third gear clutch runs back and forth on. The gray spots on the teeth here are the paste the bearing left as it got chewed up. I had a rebuild kit on hand so I just cleaned it up and put new bearings in.



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Also, those rubber bands I put on the bearings the first time do NOT disintegrate after a few days.



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This time I used brake caliper grease on the bearings. It was thick and good at holding everything together. For the fat bearings at the bottom, I just stuck them in the transmission housing and lined them up with a long screwdriver, then put the washer on them to hold them still.

Everything slid back together without a hiccup, then I tested the shifting with a pair of vise grips. Shifting was smooth, nice, and second gear now worked. Finally!


It's going to rain this weekend so probably won't be until Monday before I get it back in but as soon as I do I'll be on the road again. I miss my baby girl.


:happy:

FetchMeAPepsi June 25th, 2020 06:57 AM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Well we're going from frying pan to fryer here in Cecilia-land. I got her transmission reinstalled and the shifting works great, but there's still no engagement from the engine.
My prayer is that the clutch is stuck open (spring?) and I won't have to pull it again, but my fear is a broken flywheel. I'll get it back apart when I get more free time and post an update.

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

JoelNC September 14th, 2020 05:50 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Thanks for posting this. Super helpful!

FetchMeAPepsi September 14th, 2020 06:13 PM

Re: 1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JoelNC (Post 73037)
Thanks for posting this. Super helpful!


You're welcome! And welcome to the site (saw it was your first post)


I guess I forgot to update this thread too. I got the transmission installed again (I did mention that.../) and started the engine. Vroom!!!
Then I shifted into first gear...Vroom!
And still Cecilia refused to move. I had the Powder Puff sit in there and hold a foot on the brake for semi-safety (yes, she can reach the pedals now!!) then I crawled under the truck.
THe transmission was turning like crazy! I could see it moving all the way up until it hit the transfer case for 4wd.....

And that's when it hit me.


I jumped back in and commented to the Powder Puff how stupid I was, and how you should never be like Daddy, and how I'm probably going to quit working on anything from this point forward because I'm obviously getting senile.


Then I pressed the clutch, shifted the transfer case out of neutral and into 2wd, and Cecilia obediently moved forward.


:teehee:


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