1962 GMC 305V6 4WD Slow DD Build - Cecilia (Pic Heavy)

[Foley]

Refacing a clutch disk can usually be done by a local shop that does brake relining. Check with a auto machine shop if you have one there in town. If they do brake work, linings and disks that is, they probably can talk clutches. Disk refacing and getting the pressure plate resurfaced (if needed) is worth doing while you have that transmission out and are playing with throwout bearings etc. I don't know what a GMC clutch disk is made out of. If they are those fiber things, you might be able to locate a new one thru a parts vendor. Since I'm working my way in that direction with ol' Dudley64 I'll be interested in what you come up with. Foley

[FetchMeAPepsi]

Originally Posted by Foley

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Refacing a clutch disk can usually be done by a local shop that does brake relining. Check with a auto machine shop if you have one there in town. If they do brake work, linings and disks that is, they probably can talk clutches. Disk refacing and getting the pressure plate resurfaced (if needed) is worth doing while you have that transmission out and are playing with throwout bearings etc. I don't know what a GMC clutch disk is made out of. If they are those fiber things, you might be able to locate a new one thru a parts vendor. Since I'm working my way in that direction with ol' Dudley64 I'll be interested in what you come up with. Foley

We do have one locally so I hope they're not too high. No one sells GMC 305V6 clutches anymore so we all have to get them redone. Mine looks kinda thin IMHO, but I don't know what they look like new.

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[FetchMeAPepsi]

Today was the big removal. I ran down to NAPA and spoke to the same...humanoid.... that I ordered the parts from. He made it all the way to Assistant Manager so by golly he's got to have something rolling around in his noggin right?

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After telling me on the phone that the order was in he turned right around and told me he'd have to check on it because it wasn't showing up as delivered. Powder puff and I waited over an hour for him to get his crap together and stop playing Solitaire on the computer only to have him say, "I' sorry but tha c'putah dont tell us when tha' order aint in. It jus' didn't go in I guess. I put it in right away an' it gonna be here on Toosdee. I'll have it here waitin on ya."

Yeah right. So I shot him and made him into a seat cover.

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In my head anyway. Instead I said, "Well if that's what we have to do we'll be back Tuesday. See you then." Then I expounded on his questionable ancestry once I got back in the car.

So with that over and my head all hot I headed back to get started pulling bolts again. That tranny gunk is a bear to get off. I'm thinking it's worse than the spray-bed liner I'm putting on everything. I use that GoJo orange hand cleaner and it barely gets it off with alot of scrubbing. If you guys have anything better let me know what it is.

We started by procrastinating again. Powder Puff wanted to put the emblems back on that The Redhead hand painted for us. I want to see how the paint lasts in the weather this winter anyway so I agreed. I got them started then she took over.



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After horsing around a little I got back under there. I put a 3/8 inch wrench on the two bottom bolts that are inside the bellhousing. They're facing opposite the top two bolts. The position was awkward so I used a hammer to get them started unscrewing.



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With the last bolt almost out I put a jack under the transmission, centered under the drain hole (plug still out). They make special jacks for this but I didn't have any trouble with a regular one.



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The jack has wheels so it was easy to scoot the tranny and jack backward together to get it unplugged from the bellhousing and engine.



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Once it's pulled free just have a helper run the jack down to floor level while you hold it steady on the jack. down and out it goes. Ready for cleanup.



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[FetchMeAPepsi]

The tranny was out of the way so I could reach in and grab the throwout bearing with my fingers.



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The clutch fingers(?), those three things behind the fork poking toward the center hole, had wear scuffs on them and they were shiny. I wonder if they're supposed to be that way or if that could be my noise?



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I spent the next several hours taking off the transmission hump cover and four bolts from the bellhousing, then the hydraulic clutch bits, then the bottom starter bolt but nothing would let the bellhousing come down. Frustrated, I just started spinning the flywheel and taking these bolts off on it.



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I had to stick a screwdriver in these little circular holes in the other side to hold it still while I turned it. You can see the screwdriver at the top of the picture.



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To my surprise the entire thing dropped out on my hand when I pulled out the last bolt. It hurt like HECK too! I guess it weighs 15-20 lbs. Good thing my hand was the only thing under there. It would have busted my phone wide open. Here's the empty socket it fell out of



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And the clutch disk



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Its thickness



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And the bottom thing's thickness



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And that was it today because i dont know what's next. Id like to figure out the bell housing issue but if not I can clean it up and paint it when I get a cherrypicker and pull the engine for painting later. Not the end of the world.

I also need to figure out if my clutch is worn enough to get redone and if the bearings are bad. The throwout bearing spins nicely but it might have other issues. I just dont know what Im looking for yet.

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[BarryGMC]

The thing is toast. Pull the flywheel and have it resurfaced. 2 options on the clutch. put in a 12 inch clutch out of a 1-1-2 ton truck with a v6. Thats what I do on both gmc and chevy. I will put some pics of these on later after I go to the shop. Second take your clutch to the napa store and have the counter help compare your clutch to a chevy, buick ,pontiac. 11 inch clutch. Tell the guy you want to see a clutch for a 76 chevy 3/4 ton 4x4. He should have that. Compare the disks. they will interchange. There may be some visual differences depending on who made it, but that wont mater. Now the pressure plate is where you have to get creative. First the distance from the face of the flywheel on the gmc v6 to the mounting surface of the trans is aprox 5.75 inches. on a chevy with a truck flywheel it is aprox 4.75 inches. Now you see a range of measurements in the B,O,P. also, so there is a range of thicknesses of the whole pressure plate assembly, with gmc being the thickest. These differences are dealt with in a few ways. Ball stud height, and throwout bearing changes in conjunction with pressure plate thickness, and release finger design. The reality is you can see thicker pressure plates in the narrower dimension and thinner pressure plates in the wider dimension. Nothing has to be custom here. Especially the disk. Now finally in regard to the pressure plate. If the plate is not deeply scored you can resurface this also. However you need the services of a nice machinist. Barry

[tommyduncan]

Originally Posted by BarryGMC

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The thing is toast. Pull the flywheel and have it resurfaced. 2 options on the clutch. put in a 12 inch clutch out of a 1-1-2 ton truck with a v6. Thats what I do on both gmc and chevy. I will put some pics of these on later after I go to the shop. Second take your clutch to the napa store and have the counter help compare your clutch to a chevy, buick ,pontiac. 11 inch clutch. Tell the guy you want to see a clutch for a 76 chevy 3/4 ton 4x4. He should have that. Compare the disks. they will interchange. There may be some visual differences depending on who made it, but that wont mater. Now the pressure plate is where you have to get creative. First the distance from the face of the flywheel on the gmc v6 to the mounting surface of the trans is aprox 5.75 inches. on a chevy with a truck flywheel it is aprox 4.75 inches. Now you see a range of measurements in the B,O,P. also, so there is a range of thicknesses of the whole pressure plate assembly, with gmc being the thickest. These differences are dealt with in a few ways. Ball stud height, and throwout bearing changes in conjunction with pressure plate thickness, and release finger design. The reality is you can see thicker pressure plates in the narrower dimension and thinner pressure plates in the wider dimension. Nothing has to be custom here. Especially the disk. Now finally in regard to the pressure plate. If the plate is not deeply scored you can resurface this also. However you need the services of a nice machinist. Barry

Now that's the kind of info I like to see! Another V6 guy used a diaphragm set up for a Chevy and an old timer told me the same thing. Since I have never personally done this I wasn't going to chime in.
However... I am going to the parts store in a few and I was gonna drag the clutch from my parts motor with me to compare it to what's available. I am running a Hydramatic but I have been curious about this.
I guess the leg work has already been done!
I put the large clutch in my 61 Chevy wagon with a 3 on the tree. The older fellow behind the counter assured me it would work and it did.

Pep I have a bell housing sitting by itself. If some pics would help you to figure out if you missed a bolt lemme know. I also have two flywheels if yours is too far gone. These might be toast also, never really checked them out

I removed the clutch/flywheel the same way you did, with the bell housing still on. I had the engine still attached to the hoist but sitting on a tire on the ground. When I got all the bolts out of the flywheel I thought I had the full weight of it in my hand, but it was actually hung up on the tire. When I pulled it away from the engine it slipped off of the tire and pinned my hand against the ground. Blood spurted like a horror movie!

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My hands were black as night from all the grime(I'm not using these parts so no hurry to scrub them) and the blood was quite a contrast. It split the lowest section of my pinky wide open and left teeth marks across the callous part of the next two fingers.
I thought it was gonna be a trip to the ER but by the time I got it cleaned up it wasn't bleeding, just oozing clear fluid. I taped it real good and ignored it. Even a week later my coworker was telling me I should see a doctor but it is fine now.

[jbgroby]

Fetch,

Here is something you don't see everyday. Don't worry about marking the flywheel position, AS GMC offset 2 of the holes, The flywheel can ONLY be put back in a correct position - Neat huh?

[FetchMeAPepsi]

Originally Posted by BarryGMC

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The thing is toast. Pull the flywheel and have it resurfaced. 2 options on the clutch. put in a 12 inch clutch out of a 1-1-2 ton truck with a v6. Thats what I do on both gmc and chevy. I will put some pics of these on later after I go to the shop. Second take your clutch to the napa store and have the counter help compare your clutch to a chevy, buick ,pontiac. 11 inch clutch. Tell the guy you want to see a clutch for a 76 chevy 3/4 ton 4x4. He should have that. Compare the disks. they will interchange. There may be some visual differences depending on who made it, but that wont mater. Now the pressure plate is where you have to get creative. First the distance from the face of the flywheel on the gmc v6 to the mounting surface of the trans is aprox 5.75 inches. on a chevy with a truck flywheel it is aprox 4.75 inches.

This is brand spanking new info for me. I've read 1000 times that no one makes these clutches anymore. So much that I took it as gospel. That you found a compatible one thats still made is AMAZING!

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I'll be ordering the New Generation 04-528 Premium Clutch Kit you recommended from Amazon this week. Man I was all ready to have to press in new bearings and have some place charge me an arm and leg to rebuild my clutch disk. You saved me about $100 bucks easy! Thank you!

Originally Posted by BarryGMC

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Now you see a range of measurements in the B,O,P. also, so there is a range of thicknesses of the whole pressure plate assembly, with gmc being the thickest. These differences are dealt with in a few ways. Ball stud height, and throwout bearing changes in conjunction with pressure plate thickness, and release finger design. The reality is you can see thicker pressure plates in the narrower dimension and thinner pressure plates in the wider dimension. Nothing has to be custom here. Especially the disk. Now finally in regard to the pressure plate. If the plate is not deeply scored you can resurface this also. However you need the services of a nice machinist. Barry

Ok now i just feel stupid. I dont know what any of that means

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Originally Posted by tommyduncan

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Pep I have a bell housing sitting by itself. If some pics would help you to figure out if you missed a bolt lemme know. I also have two flywheels if yours is too far gone. These might be toast also, never really checked them out.

My flywheel looks pretty good. I think it'll be OK, but thanks! If it's not too much trouble I would like to see a few pics of the bellhousing though. I know it doesn't have to come out anymore but I'd like to clean it up and paint it since I already have six of the bolts out of it and the hydraulics and starter off. If it's too much trouble just let me know. No hard feelins!

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Originally Posted by tommyduncan

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I removed the clutch/flywheel the same way you did, with the bell housing still on. I had the engine still attached to the hoist but sitting on a tire on the ground. When I got all the bolts out of the flywheel I thought I had the full weight of it in my hand, but it was actually hung up on the tire. When I pulled it away from the engine it slipped off of the tire and pinned my hand against the ground. Blood spurted like a horror movie!

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My hands were black as night from all the grime(I'm not using these parts so no hurry to scrub them) and the blood was quite a contrast. It split the lowest section of my pinky wide open and left teeth marks across the callous part of the next two fingers.
I thought it was gonna be a trip to the ER but by the time I got it cleaned up it wasn't bleeding, just oozing clear fluid. I taped it real good and ignored it. Even a week later my coworker was telling me I should see a doctor but it is fine now.

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Originally Posted by jbgroby

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Fetch,

Here is something you don't see everyday. Don't worry about marking the flywheel position, AS GMC offset 2 of the holes, The flywheel can ONLY be put back in a correct position - Neat huh?

GROBY! I haven't see you around in a while! I did mark the bottom bolt (see the tape in the pic!) but I'm glad they made it so even I cant mess it up. Every time I learn something new about this truck I love it that much more.

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Thanks everyone for the help. You guys have your own things going on with your own lives and families and I really appreciate you taking the time to share a little knowledge with someone who easily gets in over his head.

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[BarryGMC]

You need to pull the flywheel and have it resurfaced. No ifs and's or buts. Your napa store may even be able to do it. Guys I swap transmissions like most people swap in one wire gm alternators. Its my dislike for 3 speeds and crappy aluminum 5 speeds. The 2 most common setups in jeeps. 420's are my fav with nv4500 and t-19's next. I make most of my own adapters, drivelines, and shorten and respline input/ output shafts. If it is a 1-1/8 10 spline I will figure out a clutch. I have a great friend who is a parts guy. I grew up with his little bro. He lets me play with this that and the other when I need to sort stuff out. Finally My 90 year old granpa is a machinist. His dad was a machinist. And I can spend the day playing with 3 different lathes a couple of mills, a planer,2 crank grinders, head mill, valve grinders,boring bars etc,etc. I tell him he is like Noah he seems to have 2 of everything. He also has far more old rigs than I do. He taught me to be real crafty and frugal in my old ride hobby. He also made me learn the hard way. All of the work I did at his shop in my early years was done outside in the heat,rain,cold,snow. Because he said his shop was for men to work. I spent many days right outside his door with him and his friends watching and waiting for me to quit. So if there is anything I want people to learn its to be resourceful, and persistent. These are machines. They share a huge commonality with other machines. Keep this in mind and you will find this all really easy. Barry

[FetchMeAPepsi]

I can have the flywheel resurfaced. I'll take it off this weekend. The weather's supposed to be great so I'm hoping to get all the cleanup etc. stuff done then put it all back together next weekend (21st). That just leaves me the 28th to get the step put back on so I can take the required b'day pics with the lil' blonde. Ugh time is going by too fast! Winter will be here soon then everything comes to a halt while we shiver and freeze.


Yesterday while that same lil' blonde was down for her nap I sneaked out to the garage and needle-scaled (thanks Vernski!

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) the transmission down to a more respectable dust color.

I tried a putty knife on the stuff stuck to her but...well you can see.



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The bottom was real nasty. I put the plug back in (not in pic) to flip it over so dirt didnt get in there.



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I was left with this mess on my nice clean plyboards



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Then today I dunked her in a big tupperware bin that I call my parts washer. I poured my trusty gallon of carb cleaner all over her and me and some paper towels went to scrubbin. I was going to jump in the shower before I did this but changed my mind (I can't stop thinkin about my truck lately. Obsessive much?!) and ran outside to do this one thing real quick. I don't have pics because...um...I was afraid of reflective surfaces and you guys probably just ate.



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Afterward I finished my shower, put on gloves and rinsed the tranny off with the hose. I dried it with paper towels and sat it in the sun. It'll still need wire-wheeling but overall it's much better looking. I'm gonna paint it too

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but I need to find some of that orangey paint. I thought the transmissions were black but it still has some orange on it from the factory. I order Duplicolor 1605 Ford Red engine enamel which supposedly most closely matches the color.



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For giggles I checked the seal prices on Muncie 318s and on Ebay they run about $100 for all the seals and bearings. That's probably in my future eventually, but not today!





If you're keeping track, to date I've spent about $1548.08 on Cecilia including purchase price and parts. I don't include tools because I'll use them forever, but several of them were freebies from garage sale leftovers, friends, relatives, and Freecycle. (Man I love Freecycle!)
My total budget is $4800. When I reach that mark if she'd not done enough I'll have to start selling spare bits to close the gap. If things get too tight I might have to paint her with crayons

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Train of Thought Alert!! My $4800 number came from being close to what I could resell her for if times got real hard and I had already sold most of my limbs and kidneys. It's 10% of the national average income plus $500 for shipping. Makes sense, right?

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