Grampa's 60

[Walys60]

I understood the same thing as far as the breakers adding up to more than the 100 amp but was told by a contractor friend of mine that it won't meet code. Of course that doesn't mean I couldn't swap what was in there with breakers that add up to 100 if/when I ever needed to pass an inspection

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Fetch, like David said, you might want to run a sub-panel. A plug will only do so much. I have an extension cord wire nutted to my lights and I'm running a string of 24 lights and my boom box size radio and satellite radio off the same plug from the house on an extension/surge protector, and I DID just run my drill off the same mess yesterday to put one screw in for the light switch gang box...but I turned off the lights first

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. Having lights is great, but I would hate to try and run like that permanently.

Quick breakdown of the costs for the sub (round figures)
$170 for #3 wire for box to box run (60ft)
$30 for #4 bare copper ground wire
$22 for 2 grounding rods
$70 for 2 100 amp breakers
$40 for 125 amp sub panel
$25 for 1 1/4" pvc conduit (already have the glue)

Of course, I'll still have to put breakers in but haven't bought them yet. But all should be done for under $500. Not that I'm counting anymore...bleeding cash on this thing!

[Walys60]

Figured it was a good time for an update. Got a picture of the 'weathered in' building before I moved the carport next to it, then a shot after the carport was moved and another 20 ton of rock was put in to cover up the powered dirt on the lot. Of course, I immediately had to ruin that by digging the 3' deep ditch for laying the wire for the sub panel. You can see I did get it into the side of the shop, but still have to wire the sub and the main on either end. Hoping to get that done this weekend and have REAL power to it.

Only one car will end up in the carport but I still have to move a bunch of junk I bought for the shop out of the garage before the other one will fit back into it and it's already getting too warm to leave either one out of the shade.

I'll take some pictures of the interior for posterity but right now I'm so sick of it I don't want to look at it unless I'm inside working on it. I put up runs of bailing wire from end to end of the building, about 2.5' apart and am laying out radiant barrier across the wire, then stuffing batting insulation (r30) on top of the radiant barrier. Trying o make it look decent is probably the biggest headache of it...cutting around the can lights, etc. Of 6 6' wide sections of the building I am doing this way, I have ONE done in the last 3 days of working on it (sigh). Very tedious and I don't have much time before it gets too hot to work up there.

Oh yea, one other thing...neighbor down the street called me and wants to give me his engine hoist. He's had it for a year, was given to him by another neighbor cleaning out HIS garage of things he didn't use (I helped him push it to his house). He never used it, nor plans on it, so figured he'd pass it along now too. 3rd owner, never been used...hoping to stop that trend soon!

[FetchMeAPepsi]

Looks great! Hey on that wire you ran, did you do that yourself too? I've got a shed I'd like to run electric to and I'm wondering about the specifics. I was planning to tag off from an outlet (GCFI) outside and run it down some grey plastic PVC to the shed to run the lights and another outlet. Seems like the PVC would fill up with water though and short everything out.

[David R Leifheit]

Originally Posted by FetchMeAPepsi

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Looks great! Hey on that wire you ran, did you do that yourself too? I've got a shed I'd like to run electric to and I'm wondering about the specifics. I was planning to tag off from an outlet (GCFI) outside and run it down some grey plastic PVC to the shed to run the lights and another outlet. Seems like the PVC would fill up with water though and short everything out.

I would suggest that you invest in another circuit breaker for your panel, if you can. Tagging off of an outlet is not something I would recommend. Plus if you trip the GCFI out in the shed, you'd have to come up to the outlet you tapped into to reset it -if you wired it correctly-.

Talk to a local electrician and get some advice. Most places will require you get a permit to do any electrical (I think they still let you change bulbs without a permit and inspection, although I have seen some things people have done that make me wonder how they get out of bed in the morning).
Don't take chances with electricity! Of all the things you could mess up in a structure, electricity has (in my opinion) the most potential to hurt/kill you or a loved one.

If you have an open spot in your breaker panel, or if the panel will accept the double style breakers (I am hoping you have breakers) then run a good run of 12-2 grounded wire, burial grade, from the panel to a trench (12" deep I believe is the requirement, not an electrical inspector so I could be wrong) out to your shed. *Assuming* you are only planning on lights and hand tools. Anything heavier, like even a 110v welder, I would suggest doing it right and putting in a sub panel.

Safety first, last, and always.

[Walys60]

Yes, I did it myself, but with advisement from a former professional. And my adviser was stricter than code (sigh). He suggested a 3' trench from the main to the building/sub panel, where code only requires 2', for example (what a difference 12 inches make in pain and suffering!).

Also, sounds like a big difference from what I'm doing to what you are looking to do though obviously. I'm running 100amp service to the shop and you just want some lights and an outlet.

David explained the right way to do it. You likely already have close to max outlets on the circuit you're trying to come off of from the house as it is. A new 20amp breaker in the box and burying the 12-2 'direct burial' wire really isn't that big of a deal, and not even much different then what you are talking about doing from your house outlet. In fact, using the 'direct burial' wire instead of the PVC probably offsets a fair amount of the effort and money differences in the two options.

I would never recommend (at least in writing

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) not getting a permit. However, I don't personally believe getting a permit makes anything ANY safer. All the inspections I've had so far have been somewhat interesting conversations about knowing the same people in the community, what my plans are for the building, the weather, etc., etc. Permits help fund the county government, but it's MY desire to do it right that makes it safe.

[Walys60]

Also, in addition to my adviser, I did a lot of research and youtube watching on the subject. In that I had come across this video. Your scenario reminded me of it so I went out and found it again. It sounds similar to what you are wanting to do and would be the 'right' way to to it, assuming it matches code in your area.



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[aphaynes]

Thanks for documenting your Versa-Tube build. I have been seeing ads for those buildings lately and was considering how "easy" they would really be since I need to get myself a shop built. The ads sure make it seem like it's no big deal. Ha!

Compared to the cost of your building, what's the cost of your slab equivalent, more, less? Trying to budget for it, though I don't think I will be able to go as big as you did.

[Walys60]

aphaynes,

Glad it has helped. I have to admit though, my struggles are most likely due to the fact that I am a system's administrator (Windows Server support guy) and my experience in construction to this point had been much smaller scale. I know that experienced folks can do it 'in a weekend' just like they say. I saw a youtube video on a building similar in size. Wasn't versatube, but basically the same thing without the 'swedge' technology of versatube. They had a crew of 3 and completed it in 2 days (not including the concrete of course). There are pictures of those guys walking around on the rafters though! That is NO horizontal support, SIX feet apart, 12-16 FEET in the air! Yeaaaahhh, no thanks! But, it definitely can be done...I guess.

The concrete ran me about $5500, and that is after a $500 bonus I gave to my buddy, mostly because he could use it. Retail, I would have spent probably $6000, so not a huge savings, but helped us both out some so still worth it. Of course it is somewhat dependent on location, but a 30'x50' pad, you'd expect to pay around $6k. The building cost me $11.2K, so concrete was about half again the building cost.

As much as I hated it, I doubt I could have ever built it had I paid someone to do it. I only got one estimate before I sighed and put on my big boy pants and did it...$10,500! Having done it, I'm not calling that a rip-off, just saying I wouldn't have been able to afford it.

[aphaynes]

Originally Posted by Walys60

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aphaynes,

The concrete ran me about $5500, and that is after a $500 bonus I gave to my buddy, mostly because he could use it. Retail, I would have spent probably $6000, so not a huge savings, but helped us both out some so still worth it. Of course it is somewhat dependent on location, but a 30'x50' pad, you'd expect to pay around $6k. The building cost me $11.2K, so concrete was about half again the building cost.

Thanks for all of the great info! I'll be struggling to get it done at even the DIY prices. So, I'll probably have to budget in steps, like getting the concrete done, let that sit for a WHILE, get the building, and so on.

Again, I appreciate the thread you have here as it gives me a lot of insight to planning/budgeting to get mine done.

[Walys60]

Quick update:
1. She's runnin under her own power now. I just have 1 20 amp for the 4 outlets I've got run and 2 15 amps for lights/fans for now.
2. One LAST section of radiant barrier/batting to do. Ran out of radiant barrier so waiting for the last roll to come in.
3. All 4 fans are up! and just in time, getting HOT.
4. While I'm waiting on the radiant barrier, I started on the framing for the office. I did a drawing for the framing so I'd know how much material to get and added the conceptual drawing of the garage (both done in sketchup) that I did a couple years ago now and is basically what I'm hoping to end up with

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.