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Transmissions and Rear Ends Three on the tree or four in the floor? Shift it all here. |
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Dana 44 carrier bearings, Detroit TrueTrac swap, axle shaft lengths, spline counts?
I've got a '62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck with the Dana 44 rear end.
I'd like to upgrade to a Detroit TrueTrac or Nitro Helix torsen type limited slip differential when rebuilding the rear end. I believe from referencing some old posts of mine that perhaps the 60-62 use a 10 spline axle? And 63-67 use a more common 30 spline? I see the old 10 splines are not common, and eventually 19 spline D44 axles were the standard and then 30 spline. I see mention of modern Jeep D44's being 32 spline even. I know the carrier bearings are a concern with the old Dana 44's found in our trucks. I'm not sure if there is a difference in carrier bearing size between 60-62 and 63-67 or not. So wasn't sure if you could swap an entire carrier from a newer vehicle such as the aftermarkets that I mentioned, into ours with the correct size bearing, and what that bearing size might be. Is it the carrier bearing o.d. or i.d. that's different, or both? I'd read mention years ago of someone using a more modern Dana 44 rebuild kit but having to machine a spacer to accommodate the different bearing size. So that would tell me that it is just the ID of the bearing that is larger on the newer models, or the OD of the carrier itself that slips into the bearing? Is there a source for replacement / retro fit Dana 44 30 spline axles for our vehicles? Is there a difference in width or axle shaft lengths between the 60-62 and 63-67? I've got a 2wd, so switching to a limited slip worm gear type torsen lockup diff will really help when traction is compromised pulling a trailer up steep gravel Forest Service mountain roads or in wet slippery grass. I got stuck with the one legger differential in wet grass once, it was quite embarrassing... If my gears are worn and don't check out, I may switch from 3.07 to 3.31 ratio, with the intent of swapping an AX-15 overdrive 5 speed into it. Thanks for the help!
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Chuck in Ohio *'62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck - 305D/Saginaw 4sp soon: 351C V6 + AX15 5sp OD trans, & 73-87/91 disc brake front end, rear Cadillac calipers/ AWD Astro rotors, Dana 44 redrilled to 5 lug *'88 Suzuki Samurai 4x4 project, VW 1.9L mTDI turbodiesel, Toyota V6 LandCruiser drivetrain, full floater axles, future LWB bed stretch *'77-'79 Suzuki GS motorcycles, '76 Rickman CR900 roadracer. *Dirtbikes: 2 Kawasaki KDX220R's, '77 Suzuki PE250, '83 PE175 |
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Re: Dana 44 carrier bearings, Detroit TrueTrac swap, axle shaft lengths, spline counts?
A quick search answered part of the axle spline count question, apparently all 60-68 GMC Dana 44 axles are 30-spline. That makes things a little bit easier now if carrier bearings will be able to be sourced to mate the newer Detroit TrueTrac or Nitro Helix carriers into the older GMC housings...
https://6066gmcclub.com/showthread.p...=Dana+44+axles Quote:
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Dana-44_1967-1978.pdf which that links takes you to is a Spicer catalog. Page 133 is 1967 plus GMC Dana 44, page 177 is international harvester Dana 44 half ton axles. It shows the part numbers for the GMC axle shafts no longer available, does not give a part number, only in la. But the international axles, it shows part numbers for all of them. They do show a different left versus right shaft however. What I had read here says that the GMC uses the same shaft left and right? I'll have to see if I can find any reproductions to verify that. The half ton International Dana 44 axles are probably a 5-lug I'm guessing? That would be a bonus for me if any of those were the correct lengths for the '60-'68 GMC. I could run off the shelf International Dana 44 axles and off the shelf 1987 pickup or 1991 Suburban front rotors and have my current 5 lug setup. That link does have part numbers for the carrier bearings as well, so I can at least look that up at a later date when I get more serious about this, and see what the sizes of those bearings are versus the Detroit TrueTrac OR Nitro Helix 30 spline Dana 44 limited slip.
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Chuck in Ohio *'62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck - 305D/Saginaw 4sp soon: 351C V6 + AX15 5sp OD trans, & 73-87/91 disc brake front end, rear Cadillac calipers/ AWD Astro rotors, Dana 44 redrilled to 5 lug *'88 Suzuki Samurai 4x4 project, VW 1.9L mTDI turbodiesel, Toyota V6 LandCruiser drivetrain, full floater axles, future LWB bed stretch *'77-'79 Suzuki GS motorcycles, '76 Rickman CR900 roadracer. *Dirtbikes: 2 Kawasaki KDX220R's, '77 Suzuki PE250, '83 PE175 Last edited by Chuck78; October 28th, 2023 at 03:36 AM. |
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Re: Dana 44 carrier bearings, Detroit TrueTrac swap, axle shaft lengths, spline counts?
I've just read of two guys swapping a Detroit TrueTrac into their old GMC housings now, so apparently it's not an issue. I'm going to assume the outside diameter of the bearings is the same, and the inside diameter is all that was the oddball dimension on our original carriers o.d. bearing surface, therefore a modern Dana 44 kit will fit the modern limited slip differentials...
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And here's some great info from several people on rear disc brake swaps: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...+Dana+44+axles Apparently a Wilwood kit for Ford 9" works, Wilwood brake set 140-7139, after turning down the drum/wheel register diameter on the end of the shaft to 3" or 3.07" on a lathe. The wheel bearings and the axle tube end flange are the same as the "Big Ford" bolt pattern. I have a set of the OldeDays brackets for the Ford 9" to GM Seville/79-81 Trans Am WS6 calipers, and AWD Astro Van front 5-lug rotors. I believe they are slightly larger diameter than the Cadillac rotors, and the Cadillac rotors would work with those brackets without any bracket mods. I'll mod the brackets to get slightly larger rear rotors. I think it was 11" vs 11.2"? Quote:
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Chuck in Ohio *'62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck - 305D/Saginaw 4sp soon: 351C V6 + AX15 5sp OD trans, & 73-87/91 disc brake front end, rear Cadillac calipers/ AWD Astro rotors, Dana 44 redrilled to 5 lug *'88 Suzuki Samurai 4x4 project, VW 1.9L mTDI turbodiesel, Toyota V6 LandCruiser drivetrain, full floater axles, future LWB bed stretch *'77-'79 Suzuki GS motorcycles, '76 Rickman CR900 roadracer. *Dirtbikes: 2 Kawasaki KDX220R's, '77 Suzuki PE250, '83 PE175 |
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Re: Dana 44 carrier bearings, Detroit TrueTrac swap, axle shaft lengths, spline counts?
So my only real question now comes down to axle lengths...
Currie, Moser, and Dutchman Motorsports are the recommended places to go for off the shelf or custom axles. I have yet to check any of the reproduction parts catalogs LMC, Brothers, CPP, etc And I'm wondering if any of the International half ton axles "61-74" will actually interchange? It saud those are a 5 on 5.5" pattern though? And I believe the Chevy truck 1/2 ton two-wheel drive pattern that I am after for a 75 or 76-91 Suburban for 75 or 76-87 pickup is a 5 on 5"? I'll have to go out and measure.
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Chuck in Ohio *'62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck - 305D/Saginaw 4sp soon: 351C V6 + AX15 5sp OD trans, & 73-87/91 disc brake front end, rear Cadillac calipers/ AWD Astro rotors, Dana 44 redrilled to 5 lug *'88 Suzuki Samurai 4x4 project, VW 1.9L mTDI turbodiesel, Toyota V6 LandCruiser drivetrain, full floater axles, future LWB bed stretch *'77-'79 Suzuki GS motorcycles, '76 Rickman CR900 roadracer. *Dirtbikes: 2 Kawasaki KDX220R's, '77 Suzuki PE250, '83 PE175 |
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Re: Dana 44 carrier bearings, Detroit TrueTrac swap, axle shaft lengths, spline counts?
AXLES!!!!
Nitro "cut to length" 30-spline triple drilled Dana 44 axle shafts, 5x4.5, 5x5", & 5x5.5" bolt patterns! $184!!!! https://justdifferentials.com/nitro-...r-dana-44.html https://nitro-gear.com/nitro-gear-ax...1971-2018.html It says they work for any length from narrow 24.5" Jeep axles up to 32" wide, and I believe ours measure 30.5" according to one comment I read? Please confirm before ordering but I believe ours definitely should fit within this range. Our trucks have fairly narrow wms-wms width axles (wheel mounting surface). The only thing I'm uncertain on is the center register diameter. This is very easy to turn down in a lathe or make or buy a bushing/adapter for though. Chromoly 30-spline Dana 44 5 lug on 5" axles for less than $200 each... Wow The only other thing I haven't 100% confirmed is the stock being 30 spline. I read a few mentions of 19 spline, others saying 63-68 were 30 spline, perhaps meaning 60-62 were 19 spline? If running a Nitro Helix 30 spline limited slip, this makes no difference at all regardless.
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Chuck in Ohio *'62 GMC 1000 Panel Truck - 305D/Saginaw 4sp soon: 351C V6 + AX15 5sp OD trans, & 73-87/91 disc brake front end, rear Cadillac calipers/ AWD Astro rotors, Dana 44 redrilled to 5 lug *'88 Suzuki Samurai 4x4 project, VW 1.9L mTDI turbodiesel, Toyota V6 LandCruiser drivetrain, full floater axles, future LWB bed stretch *'77-'79 Suzuki GS motorcycles, '76 Rickman CR900 roadracer. *Dirtbikes: 2 Kawasaki KDX220R's, '77 Suzuki PE250, '83 PE175 Last edited by Chuck78; October 28th, 2023 at 06:42 AM. |
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